Higher education is a major issue in current public debate. Should it be accessible for everyone? Why or why not? If not, for whom? How much responsibility should federal and state governments bear for providing higher education? These questions are complicated, difficult, and likely to remain in open debate for a long time. Consider, for example, a series of op-ed essays called “Should College Be for Everyone?” that the New York Times recently published. This piece, written by Lawrence Mishel of the non-partisan Economic Policy Institute, is part of the series, and was published in March 2012.
Read it here: Mishel, “College Is Not Always the Answer”
- Mishel outlines three key requirements for ensuring that non-college jobs are worthwhile, respectable, and desirable. Do you agree that the three components Mishel identifies are all necessary? Are they sufficient? What would you add or subtract from his list? Explain your reasoning.
- You’re in college now. Why did you choose to pursue a college degree? How much of your motivation was economic in nature? What other factors entered into your decision? If you were to learn that your college degree wouldn’t change your lifetime earning potential, would getting a degree still be your goal?
- You may find a great deal of overlap between Mishel’s argument here and Charles Murray’s argument in chapter 14 of your textbook. In what ways do their approaches differ? Which of the two arguments is more persuasive to you? Why?
- Mishel concludes with a call to challenge the “snobbery” he sees in attitudes that college graduates are somehow superior to non-graduates. Have you observed this snobbery in your life? Would your own attitudes meet Mishel’s description of snobbery? How would you respond to Mishel’s assessment? Write an essay in which you examine the attitudes around you—yours and those of people influential in your life—towards non-college graduates. Are they considered less intelligent? Less skilled?
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I can agree with what Mishel is saying. Hes Right. college isn’t always the answers. there are things you can do without having a college degree and still be classified as middle class with benefits. School/College isn’t for everyone, why waste your money on something that may not benefit you in the future because you don’t have the mindset to go to school? If you have better opportunities in the world other than going to college, take them.
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I belive collge is a way to get a better career then not going to collge and just having a job with min wage.
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1.) The key components mentioned by Mishel are, “strong labor standards, a tangible ability to obtain union representation, and mandated benefits in requirement”. I agree that these points are very sufficient and necessary to make non-college jobs beneficial to their employees. Mishel should have expanded on these points to show how important they are to make this kind of a job desirable.
2.) I am choosing to strive to earn a college degree so that I can one day be successful and so my knowledge can be bettered about my desired career. A lot of my motivation to obtain a degree comes from wanting a generous income so that I can one day provide a comfortable life for my future family, my talents, interests, and other future desires. If i discovered that my college degree would not change my lifetime earning potential, a degree would still be my goal. I believe that it is important to pursue your interests and talents and to strive to become knowledgeable about all things. Obtaining a college education would only better myself.
3.) Mishel’s and Murry’s articles are both very similar as far as their overall message but they both are also very different. Mishel’s contained many great points but it lacked background information to back up his claims. Murry’s article, on the other hand, also made very good points but also provided sources and background information to support his assertions.
4.) Mishel claims that, “There is plenty of snobbery afoot regarding college educations” and goes on to say that our nation and universities do not value those who do not desire to gain a college education or have not yet earned their degree. I have observed this kind of “snobbery” in my life. It is a pretty common belief that to be successful, you must attend college and get a degree. I have learned that this is not always true. There are many who choose not to attend college and are still successful and happy. Not everyone looks down on those who choose this path but I can see how they would feel not as good as a college graduate. It is important. When I am a college graduate I will not look down on those who have chosen not to attend college because I strongly believe that no one is better and than anyone and those people and their decisions deserve to be accepted and respected. Everyone should understand that they are not less intelligent or less skilled, they just have a different plan for themselves.
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I completely agree with this article in the fact that everyone should be getting adequate pay and benefits. Regardless of whether you go to college or not, however I do think we should encourage some people to go to college, not only for the hopes of making more money. But also to find out who they are. Some people might just do a career trade that they think they are good at, or has been a family tradition. But what if they’re missing out on their true talent.
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To answer the fourth and final prompt, I agree that other destinations instead of the traditional four-year college should be considered and the path of education beyond high school does not determine the intelligence of the student, however their desire on their vocation and future.
All throughout secondary school, especially the last years headed to college, one after another, the typical adult individual questions the average student on their path in life. “Where are you going to school?” “What do you want to major in?” “Have you applied to any colleges yet?” Questions such as these are thrown at the student, always expecting to the adolescent to know the answer. The idea of college is indeed glorified in our society and is demanded that the ordinary individual must attend or else face an unproductive life. I agree that the option of community college and vocational schools brought up by the author and our former president, Barak Obama, are more than qualified choices for further education routes and must be taken into consideration and not thrown aside. However, when the question of “What are you going to do with your life in the future?” is answered with the desire to go to community college or vocational school, noses are turned, and instant disregard for the person’s intelligence is developed. This is when prejudices are formed, ruining the student’s chance for a higher reputation with the other individual. However is this entirely the student’s fault? Are they to blame for choosing something so untraditional as community college or vocational school? Absolutely not, and these are the “snobberies” that Lawrence Mishel detailed in his article, “snobberies” by thinking the only way to a successful life is through a four-year college education. Granted that college prepares the student for a proper job in their respective degree, other paths to successful employment derive from other sources than college. “Knowledge is Power,” a quote by the philosopher, Francis Bacon, is often overused and distorted. According to this logic, attending four-year college should provide the student with adequate, or even more, material to lead a successful life due to intelligence. However, this is not the case. Contrary, many skilled businesspeople, and entrepreneurs, such as Michael Dell, founder of Dell Technologies, and Larry Ellison, chief technology officer of the Oracle Corporation, dropped out of school to further their careers. Notably intelligent men, Dell and Ellison, became prime examples of the successful dropout. Skill coincided with intelligence gives the student attending a non-traditional school poor judgment on their future, again leading onto these “snobberies.” In conclusion, whether one desires to attend a four-year university or a vocational school, it is merely a reflection of how one wants to further their future and their direction towards a career.
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I think that it is totally up to the individual that is thinking of pursuing to go to college to know if college is right for them. many times people follow in their parents footsteps or just want to be better in life. But, whichever it is college is going to cost. Is it worth it well that also depends on the major, connections and ambition that the person will take to make sure they get into the field of their choice. Do I think college is for everyone? No, I do not if the person is not sure that college is what they want to do it would be a waste of time and money. I decided to enter into college because I had a purpose and that was to get the degree I need to help others in life and I can only do that by getting the degree I have and am pursuing.
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No one person should be denied a right to continue their education. We as a generation should not force kids to go to college if there is no desire to obtain a degree. I went to college because there was only one way I could have played basketball. Majority of the students in my class played some type of sport or was in college because it was pushed on them from an early age. We were told, college equates to higher paying jobs. I have learned that is a false statement depending on a occupation. Kids should be aware of the opportunities that vocational or apprenticeship this route would eventually pay you to obtain a degree or take classes to advance your role in the company.
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I entered college initially to prove a point to myself. I was a teen mom, I heard so many things badly stated about being a teen mom that I had to prove a point to myself that I wasn’t a stereotype. Once I completed my Associates I knew I could get my BS, I did take time off to grow my family but returned to school as I had promised myself, once that was completed I have to admit that the reasoning behind obtaining my masters was financial earning potential when I began. What I’ve learned over the last year is that I enjoy the learning process. I have made great sacrifices and so has my family for me to continue my education, so I still hope that it pays off financially someday. The cost of schooling is astronomical it feels like, especially if you are an adult returning or married, there is no real financial assistance provided. If nothing else, my children see my dedication to my education and I hope that even if my financial potential does not excel that they are understanding and learning the lesson of hard work, dedication and determination.
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I am currently enrolled in a Graduate program, have my BSW from Spring Arbor University (Liberal Arts school) and also work in the Financial Aid Office at a private liberal arts university. In my opinion, a liberal arts education is a type of schooling that teaches lifelong skills which will enable a person with the critical thinking ability, effective writing as well as analyzing skills needed in many career paths available to workers not only in the United States but also abroad. Education not only in liberal arts colleges/universities as well as in trade schools should not be limited to only the few who can afford to pay for this themselves or through familial assistance. Students from all social economic statures have proven to be able to be successful and use their education to not only further their own career paths but also to assist others when working in fields such as helper fields of Nursing, Social Work, Education, etc. Throughout history, people have migrated and immigrated to the United States due to the vast opportunity our Country offers to not only our own citizens, but also others who have entered our great nation legally and sometimes illegally. It is only through greater education opportunities that in my opinion we can strengthen the skills of our current and future workforce to be competitive not only in our nation but also internationally.
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College should be accessible for everyone. College allows those who are willing to work hard an opportunity. The government either allow for an ease of the market, basically protecting students from predatory loans, or pay for those who cannot afford it. The outlines make sense in that non college jobs need to be cared for. The market for them will continue to grow. I am pursuing a college degree for money and personal pride. If there was no economic value in this education, I would most likely not be here. The approach in terms of example is very noticeable. Mishels article expects you to just run along with what is being said. Snobbery is a strong word.
There is a stigma that college graduates are smarter, however I don’t believe that someone’s intelligence is based on their education. Judging people just off a degree is simply unwise. Getting a degree definitely increases your knowledge in a specific area, but outside that area, who are you to judge other people. For instance, my younger brother by a year is extremely intelligent, despite barely passing high school. He retains information he finds relevant at a ridiculous rate, but didn’t have the motivation to even finish high school, let alone attend college.
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I believe the government should pay for college like they do in Germany. So far, it has been proven that the economy benefits from college graduates. There might not be enough jobs out there for all the college degrees but even the lower standard jobs would benefit from someone who is educated. I believe it will make our country stronger and less ignorant. Everyone deserves a good education even if you can not afford college. We will have a better chance of starting new businesses which will open up even more jobs if we are all college graduates.
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I agree to college is not for everyone. Also I agree that there should be more options for people without college degrees with better benefits. But I still think college is important.
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I agree to college is not for everyone. Also I agree that there should be more options for people without college degrees with better benefits. But I still think college is important.
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To me I believe college should be accessible to everyone, everyone deserves a chance to try to better their lives through school. Everyone should have to option of weather they would like to further their education, yeah it may not be for everyone but it show an option for everyone because you never if some would change their mind later about the decision. I’m attending college because I want make my life a lot easier when it comes to working for the rest of my life. I want to be able to do something I love to do with having to struggle to get to the point. Also to be able to pass my learnings down to our next generation so that they can see how college is always an option for anyone who wants to attend and better themselves.
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Mishel outlines three key requirements for ensuring that non-college jobs are worthwhile, respectable, and desirable. Do you agree that the three components Mishel identifies are all necessary? Are they sufficient? What would you add or subtract from his list? Explain your reasoning.
I personally agree with Mishel. I work for a corporation now with only a high school degree.I truly believe he has the right idea. These jobs need to be worthwhile, maybe room for growth and room for higher pay but you cant be stuck with the same old job going nowhere with it in this economy. Respect is very important! At most job you have to work your way up and with that being said just because you are higher you still need to respect whose lower. Desiring your job is a key or having a job that is desirable. Doing something useful for you and whoever you are doing it for is very important. I wouldnt change anything he is saying because I work for a corporation know so I get it and agree with his 3 requirments.
You’re in college now. Why did you choose to pursue a college degree? How much of your motivation was economic in nature? What other factors entered into your decision? If you were to learn that your college degree wouldn’t change your lifetime earning potential, would getting a degree still be your goal?
I think college is something you do for yourself. You do it for a good job sometimes yes, maybe higher pay? Who doesnt love money! I personally did it for both of those things. College is an unknown thing till you are apart of it. I dont fully know what I want to be when I “grow up” or where I wanna go, but I believe with a degree it makes finding out or deciding a little easier.
You may find a great deal of overlap between Mishel’s argument here and Charles Murray’s argument in chapter 14 of your textbook. In what ways do their approaches differ? Which of the two arguments is more persuasive to you? Why?
I think Mishel’s approach is quite simple, requirments and things to strive for regardless of if you are a college student seeking or having a degree or someone who wishes not to attend college.
Mishel concludes with a call to challenge the “snobbery” he sees in attitudes that college graduates are somehow superior to non-graduates. Have you observed this snobbery in your life? Would your own attitudes meet Mishel’s description of snobbery? How would you respond to Mishel’s assessment? Write an essay in which you examine the attitudes around you—yours and those of people influential in your life—towards non-college graduates. Are they considered less intelligent? Less skilled?
I grew up in Parkland. FL, a more wealthy community with rich kids and nice schools, with that being said from my expierences in highschool and now in college I do see what Mishel’s saying. People I grew up with that had more money and went to school, had more entitlement but I havent figured out if its the money or the degree. I think it truly depends on who you are dealing with. Some people with money, work for it, which means that money took work just like the degree. Where I believe others use the money as the entitlment and dont strive to have the best degree or best grades to get to the degree. The way I felt before I started college did make me feel unskilled. I dont think everyone feels that but spending the money on pencils, pens and classes made me proud. Striving to do my work as good as possible does make me feel some sort of power but I do not think that power will turn into being snobby, hopefully! I believe those who strive in college and get degrees do have more oppurtunity to strive in life and jobs so I can see where people who feel that power. I wanna be a leader of something one day, weither its being a vet or owning my own dog grooming/hotel, or wherever my college expierence takes me, but in my opinion a good leader leads by example and snobbery is not a good lead to anything. So I choose to not follow the people I have seen that show this trait. My dad grew up in a small town in New Jersey, he was a surfer kid back in the day, but his family wasnt wealthy by any means, his dad was a cop and his mom was teacher, my dad has a bacherlors degree and a few others I believe and is pretty self made, now making 80$ an hour which equals about 166,400 a year so that is defiently something that makes him more skilled and I think gives him more bragging rights. I aspire to be self made and a leader, with no snobby-ness!
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Everyone should have a right to higher education. I also believe that not all people are meant to be in college. I wanted to go to college because I feel like I have a better chance getting a good job rather than not having a degree.
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I trust that everybody has a privilege to a high training and to a professional education yet in the event that they chose to dispose of finical guide then different individuals won’t have the capacity to go.With budgetary such huge numbers of individuals can go,which can make them experience difficulty landing a position since these days a few employments really require the individual applying for the activity to have a partners degree.So I trust they ought haven’t dispose of pale stipends and monetary guide without it many individuals won’t have the capacity to have a vocation or instruction.
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I believe higher education should be of access to everyone. However, it would be better it should continue to be challenging to get this education. This means you would have to work for your education more than others and inspire competition.
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Higher education should be available for everyone, but that does not mean everyone will utilize. Students that even go to college that doesn’t necessarily mean they are hard workers too. The government should take part in our education for those that want to advance their education. Most jobs require a college degree of some sort aiding with financial aid. The key outlines that Mishel aren’t enough. Most look more in a job for benefits sustaining family and making job actually desirable. I chose to pursue college degree to help further me in the future and attain the job I desire. Other factors put in was what I was interested in and what I see myself doing later in my future. The difference is Mishel’s work isn’t credible as the author is making all these claims but no evidence to back them up. There is snobbery as those with a college degree tend to look down onto those that do not have one, but having a college degree does not make you a better person and doesn’t necessarily mean you would be better for the job than the person without a degree.
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Getting a degree from a four year college doesn’t fit everyone like a glove. Most students know what they want to do when they graduate high school, and if it’s not wasting money going to an expensive college when it could be cheaper somewhere else, then so be it. If a community college costs less for the same degree, gives you more time to get settled in the work force and start earning money, then go for it. It’s the smarter, more educated choice.
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I believe that students should not feel forced or required to attend college but should consider other educational options such as training required for a job, technical school, or consider a gap year in order to find out what you want to pursue rather than waste money and time on something you might not be passionate about.
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1.) I believe the components Mishel identifies are necessary for non-college jobs are respectable. Union representation, strong labor standards, and the mandated benefits for retirement are all necessary. I believe this because all three work together to provide a solid base for non-college Jon benefits. 2.) I chose to peruse a college degree because I want to get a higher education. I enjoy learning, so very little of it was based on economic factors alone, mostly because I want to experience the college life. Even if getting my degree wouldn’t change my life earnings, I would still like to try and earn it because I would stil want to live that college experience. 3.) I believe Mishel’s argument is more convincing because he points out that a third of workers have a four year degree or higher, but less jobs are needed in which you need a degree. By pointing this out, Mishel is showing that there is more need for non-degree people to get these jobs. 4.) Mishel states that there is a certain level of “snobbery” when it comes to people with degrees and those without. I have seen this before, not in an extreme manner, but when someone with a degree tries to make the final decision than someone with without. I would say Mishel’s argument is valid, because in life, people with degrees are usually favored over those without when it comes to jobs. When it comes to those who hold degrees, they are seen as more-skilled than those without because it is assumed they have gotten more experience while they were studying in college.
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1) I agree with Mishel that union representation, strong labor standards, and mandated benefits are important for making no-college jobs worthwhile. I feel like good pay and retirement benefits I think that people that go into non-college jobs should feel secure in their job choice and not like they should have to change what they are doing.
2) I decided to pursue a college degree because all of the jobs that I am interested in require a college degree. A small part of my motivation is in economic nature because i want a job that pays well. Other factors that helped me make my decision is I wanted to see what it is life living outside of my hometown. Even if i could get the job that i want without a college degree I think I would still go to college to experience all of what it has to offer, both in and out of the classroom. I like learning new things and I want to experience college for everything that it is.
3) there approaches are different because Mishel is saying that college degrees are needed but we also need people who don’t have a college degree in the workforce. While Murray is saying instead of going to college teach the kids the basics of what they need to know for life all in high school. Mischel’s argument is more persuasive to me because he is still giving the reader the choice on going to college or not instead of saying that they just shouldn’t go to college.
4) I have seen this “snobbery” attitude that Mishel mentions, mostly from 35-40 year olds that think they know everything because they went to college. I personally don’t think I have this “snobbery” attitude because I don’t go around bragging that i’m in college or saying/thinking that I’m going to get a better job than a person that doesn’t go to college. From what I have seen and heard most of the people around me think that people that don’t go to college are either lazy or they just know what is best for them and there is really no inbetween. They’re not really considered less intelligent because they all know people who could’ve gone to college but chose not to. Some of the people in my life view people who didn’t go to college or any form of higher education as less skilled because they think that those people don’t know as much about what they are doing as a person who got a form of higher education.
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I can agree with what Lawrence Mishel is saying. Collage isn’t always the answer for everybody, but I believe college should be open to everyone. There are so many alternatives careers you can pursue without having a college degree and still have benefits and make just as much money as someone with a college degree. College isn’t for everyone, so why waste your time and money on something that may not benefit you in the future. If you have better opportunities in the world besides going to college then you should consider them because the return you get after college doesn’t always positively compare to your investments you made.
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TH:
I feel that there should be options for everyone. There should be more options for individuals that do not want to go to college. There should be more options for trades and internships. There are some people that are good with their hands and need on the job training.
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Higher education may become an issue but does not mean education should not be provided to them. We can’t say Going to college is just wastage of money. Many students are there for whom study is important. Moreover, college gives you a higher education with which you can receive a higher salary and the job according to your wish depends upon the degree.
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Higher education may become an issue but does not mean education should not be provided to them. We can’t say Going to college is just wastage of money. Many students are there for whom study is important. Moreover, college gives you a higher education with which you can receive a higher salary and the job according to your wish depends upon the degree.
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Higher education may become an issue but does not mean education should not be provided to them. We can’t say Going to college is just wastage of money. Many students are there for whom study is important. Moreover, college gives you a higher education with which you can receive a higher salary and the job according to your wish depends upon the degree.
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Higher education should be accessible to each and everyone.This will enable individuals to enhance skills geared towards their choice of careers.
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I think college as much as it is risky is very beneficial. One really gets to learn a lot of life skills other than just education.
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In Korea, many people think it is natural and mandatory to go to college. The reason I entered college was that I felt like I had to come to college. Because many jobs are recruited for college graduates. I also wanted to know more about the areas I’m interested in, but it seems that it’s more natural to be in college. Learning from college is fun. But if the university did not change my income potential, I probably decided not to go to university. Also, if I want a university degree in the career I want, I will go to college.
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Mishel argues the controversial topic of college being worthwhile. The majority of Americans today see college as a requirement due to either their family or just the standards around them. It is seen that one must attend college in order to acquire a stable well paying job with benefits. Although Americans think this way and share this stereotypical idea, it is not the case. Those who do not receive a college degree are labeled as “unintelligent” or “unskilled”, however this could not be more far off. There are people that make an equivalent or even a higher amount of money than those who attend college and that is because not all jobs that are worthwhile require a college degree. Jobs fitting into this category include construction workers, electricians, or repairmen. Due to the fact that these jobs exist, it is unethical to think with the mindset of one can only be successful if they attend college.
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Education should be available to everyone. Now, the level of education should depend on what is best for the person and their abilities. Some individuals are excited about a vocational education where they can option a career in a craft that interests them. Or an apprenticeship program that will allow a person to obtain knowledge in a field that will enable them to support themselves and their family. Some students do well in a community college or a four-year enviornment.
When I decided to go back to school, I knew that I needed to attend a community college to obtain my Associate’s Degree, then transfer to a four-year college to get my Bachelor’s Degree. For me, completing my education has always been important. The degree with advance my career chances, but mostly it is a personal goal.
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As a 40-year old student returning to school after 23 years, I am in complete agreement with Mishel. Had my recent jobs offered a living wage, I don’t know that college would have been on my agenda. I did receive vocational training in 2 different fields however, neither paid enough to sustain me. I currently work odd jobs.
Coming back to school was a choice I made because I am now eligible to receive grant money for my education. Had it not been for the financial assistance I’m receiving; I would not return. Based on the great disparity between the cost of school and annual incomes, it would not be in my best interest to take on the debt that often comes with attending college.
I have never been one to believe that college is the only way. In fact, it was my objective to everything my own way. The problem isn’t college or no college, the real issue is wages. If wages for the working class were higher than individuals could chose the path that is right for them regardless of the whether that path is college. We need to make other options worthwhile so that all trades maintain their quality, value and importance.
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A college education is important for all. How far in your education and what your personal educational goals are, should be up to you. Personally, I would love to attend a private university. Yet, that comes with a hefty tab. It would be great to have the financial freedom to peruse my education. Community College is definitely a hidden gem!
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Since we adhere to college, we put in our heads that if we do not pursue higher education we can not succeed or have work. But during the last two decades, many people have work without having four-year university degrees because having made training that allow them to have the ability to handle the job. For some, university studies are essential because it gives you knowledge and practices needed to work and also most academic grades have an intelligence above the average requested. In addition, many people take the opposite path to get a job because assuming that being at the university does not guarantee you to have better work status or be smarter than the others who have not done. These training people do not often have what they expect from the university because they quickly want to pair a job. But according to Michel the demand for university graduates is increasingly increasing, he believes that to get aware or enhanced the people who have trained can compensate for the tributary of demand but the situation of the demand is still unchangeable. For me, having academic degrees is one thing that anyone with future ambitions must get to blinder his profile, but also have the experience of holding a job. However, training people also have the ability to manage the same duties as the university student but unlike diplomas.
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Being a student currently enrolled in college and going through classes during a pandemic, I sometimes come to wonder if it’s all worth it. But when I think about this I need to think about the repercussions of not finishing college and attaining a degree. For my career field that I want to pursue, fire department or police department, for most of the positions they require at least 60 credits to get the job. Sometimes you need a higher education to get promotions and rise through ranks. I chose to pursue a degree because of this reason, but not only because of my work aspirations but also because of a precedent set by my family members to pursue a degree. If I were not to achieve this precedent I would feel less successful compared to my siblings. Although if I were not to achieve this I could very easily enter the tradesmen work force. Being a tradesman nowadays compared to the past is a much better career choice and could lead one to a very successful person in life.
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